New Shimano rod kit

(todoroki toshirou) #21

I fully agree :laughing:
Even if the place and the fish are different, it is because the fishermen who use the same tool :smile:

(David Walker) #22

Earlier today, to fill in the time while my wife went into the grocery store, I was filling in the time reading a kindle book on kanji and found a good, but simple sentence to illustrate why we have a difficult time translating Japanese into English and probably vice versa. We simply think of words in sentences in almost completely the opposite way round.

The kanji being described in the book was 上, (spoken as either ue or jō + a few other ways too).
The example Japanese sentence was , “上を見てください” (Ue o mite kudasai.).
Wherein the word order is - Up (o) look please.
In English we would say, “Please look up.” What? The reversed mirror image. :smile:

More complex sentences need more sub-parts flipped round to arrive at anything close to English sentence word order. The challenge is in determining which parts to flip round. And also picking out the correct translation to use for different words. 上 in addition to meaning up, may also mean: above, higher, top, on, etc.

Clay & Yumi Boutwell’s thejapanesepage 上

(Peder) #23

Thanks for sharing that @dwalker, very helpful. What book was it?

(David Walker) #24

The book at the bottom of the homepage, Kanji 100. Looks like you can get it free now. I paid for it.

Generally I think large books of Kanji are not a good way to learn them. But the one in this book are pretty common. You’ll see them used often on tenkara websites. I’ve learned what a lot of kanji mean when I see them, but often don’t recall the romaji for them. It’s like knowing triangular signs are caution signs or the shape of a stop sign. Having the kindle book is handy to fill in time while waiting for something, and maybe I’ll finally remember the romaji. Till then I don’t have to know the romaji for kanji like 回, I just remember 10回 is 10x, ten times, for example. But it’s better to recall 回 is “kai”.

(望月正樹) #25

ト口 (to kuchi) mouth.
David San ln this case all those words explain the names of points of river .トロ Is (to-ro) a point very slowly water run or almost still water.
Katakana ‘s ロ (ro)and Kanzi’s ロ(ku-chi) these shapes are same looking in print.

(David Walker) #26

Mangefu-san, thank you.

I am familiar with: kuchi (くち、口 ) mouth. From pictures similar to this one:

穂先の・種類 [ tip type / kind ]
a) ヘビ口, hebi kuchi , snake mouth
b) リリアン, ririan, Lillian.

竿・銘 rod inscription
脇・銘 side inscription

And a few other kanji that at a quick look, are almost the same, but different.
Similar to ro: (ろ)、ロ vs kuchi 口.
Are the kanji for; stone (ishi) 石 vs right (migi) 右. I have learned to read carefully to get the correct English word. [ Just to complete the set for anyone else trying to learn kanji, left is ( hidari) 左. ]

The Tsuribito web page for First step - Keiryū fishing - Start guide, second part,
Is a good page to look at for anyone interested in learning Japanese names for stream currents, or tips on how to interpret the motion of line sight markers 目印 ( mejirushi. 目・印 : 目マーク). I think it doesn’t matter that the webpage is aimed at bait fishing, for kebari fishing it would be the same. [For those interested keiryū bait fishing (エサ釣り) see part one. :wink:

(望月正樹) #27

David San this picture shows how Katakana made from. I think you will be interesting in this. Actually katakana ロcame from Kanji呂’s oneロ.so same!!!

(David Walker) #28

Mangetu-san, thank you. 字体の由来 [ origin of font ]

Interesting that in many languages the written characters are believed to have evolved from pictographs that rotated over time. Just as the katakana are pieces of kanji, sometimes rotated to form the simpler katakana character. And kanji themselves evolved from pictographs.

For example: I have read that the English A, was derived from a pictograph of a bull’s head with horns. It gradually rotated 180˚, became more angular, and became the A. [maybe that is true, or maybe just a good story dreamed up by some linguist. ] :thinking::confused:

I found something interesting comparing the ja.wikipedia for katakana かな).
And the en.wikipedia for katakana.

ja.wikipedia 片仮名

Which is this:
" In contrast to the hiragana syllabary, which is used for Japanese words not covered by kanji and for grammatical inflections, the katakana syllabary usage … is used for transcription of foreign language words into Japanese and the writing of loan words (collectively gairaigo); …"
" Katakana is commonly used to write the Ainu language by Japanese linguists.…"

There has been some curiosity why - tenkara is more commonly written in katakana, as テンカラ. When tenkara is a uniquely 和式 毛鉤釣り方法, Japanese style of fly or kebari fishing method. And should be written in a font for a native word.
[Or is it, 和風毛鉤釣り方法? I haven’t yet figured out if there is a subtle difference in how 和式 & 和風 should be used. Both translate as “Japanese style”, I think one is for style of doing things, the other for style of things/objects]

And tenkara less commonly written in hiragana, as てんから. The font for a native Japanese word.
At least that the case today, though in many places, and in older books the hiragana font, てんから is used.
The font choice used could just be due to the trends of how word usage changes over time.

However, there seems to be some speculation that tenkara was spread by the Matagi (又鬼) , the winter hunters of the Tōhoku region of northern Japan. But they are said to have much in common with the Bear Cult of the Ainu. Possibly Ainu in origin. Could it be possible tenkara is more commonly written as テンカラ because katakana is commonly used to write words from the Ainu language?

In the Ainu language (アイヌ語) they use a modified form of katakana. “Ainu syllables are CV©, that is, they have an obligatory syllable onset and an optional syllable coda. …”

Sorry, this is way off the topic of “New Shimano rod kit”. :slightly_frowning_face:

(望月正樹) #29

David San. Maybe You have to make a new topic about a (Japanese Kanji and Kana). Todoroki san knows about these Kebari culture and history in Japan very well deeply of course including Tenkara

I wish you could read his article which shows Japanese Kebari culture so clearly. My English is too poor to translate his article. I hope Todoroki san will write that in near future .

(Peder) #30

This is an excellent idea. Thank you for the suggestion.


(todoroki toshirou) #31

満月様 ご紹介ありがとうございます :smile:

(David Walker) #32

I can translate it fairly well, by going one paragraph at a time. A slow process, but I learn a lot in the process.
A good project for a snowy day like today. Only a few people are interesting in doing translation, but many would probably enjoy reading Todoroki-san’s kebari research.

[ I should have stayed home today and worked on translating it. Instead I went out to drive to the city to attend an amateur radio event at the civic center. Got there after it was over, and unfortunately discovered some time between Thursday and today my car developed a 9 in (23cm) crack in the windshield. There’s always some new surprise. ] :frowning_face: