Over complicated Tenkara

Ah…Paul just revealed he is an mma junky. Paul…you savage.

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Hee hee. It’s in my bio on the “About us” page on the DT site, but I would say that enjoy the technical part more than being punched on the nose (so I’ve done more Judo, BJJ and Tomiki Aikido with just a smattering of boxing).

Great thread.

On a somewhat related side note. I have a friend who fights MMA and she says very similar things about that as are being discussed here.

To me, a master knows what they are doing, why they are doing that (and why they’re not doing something else), and can explain it to me in a way that my wee brain can make sense of. Not to mention a number of other things about how they present themselves.

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MMA taps into the savage in all of us…our fundamental roots.

I really enjoy it and so does my wife…which is pretty funny as she doesn’t normally like violence.

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There are more than a few outside of Japan and they don’t do any other types of angling,

Tenkara only.

It’s not what you know.

It’s what you do.

People squirm when it comes to that word.

Master.

It took me a while to figure out, no longer my problem.

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ok

https://10colorstenkara.com/t/technique-vs-technology/471

I’ve long been attracted to George Leonard’s (aikido guy) view about the path to mastery, or success and long term fulfillment in any activity as presented in his book, “Mastery”.

A few of his key points taken from the below linked summary of the book:

Practice is often used as a description of what we do.
Instead, we can/should look at practice as something we have, … (iow, not something to be dreaded, but looked forward to)

The five keys to mastery: Instruction, Practice, Surrender, Intentionality, and The Edge.

Rewards will always come to someone who commits to the practice, but the rewards are not the goal.
The practice is the goal.

Mastery reveals so much more to learn as you continue the journey.
The destination is two miles farther away for every mile we travel.

Mastery is practice. Mastery is staying on the path.

There are no experts. There are only learners.

Mastery is not about perfection. It’s about the process.
[ kind of an W. Edwards Deming view I think. Not zero defects, but rather continuous process control improvement]

If you want to truly master something, you must be willing to remain a beginner and look a fool.
The beginner’s mind is required for learning anything new.

http://jamesclear.com/book-summaries/mastery

Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming - also touches on that last point - when asked why his Taijiquan or Qigong forms today do not look the same today as they were 40 years ago - he replies that if his form movements today were the same as forty years ago then he would be a lousy student. Who had wasted his time over the last 40 years because he did not learn a deeper understanding of the art.

In that regard I guess I’m doing ok with my attitude. I don’t need to catch a lot of fish to feel like I had a good day out fishing. (though I do not like to be skunked, at least one please). I truly enjoy what I call, the joy of casting, each cast I intend to be better than the last one. More accurate, more beautiful. Catching a fish is a bonus and some evidence I am getting more than just a pretty cast. ( that is also one reason why after recently trying Lantern Fishing, I did care for it. There is no casting. Maybe it’s a good survival method to catch fish if hungry, but for me it wasn’t much fun.)

And for me actual fishing is part of practice. It’s not just casting to cat can. But for practice to be effective or efficient, it needs to be something that pushes your limits, where you are not doing everything perfectly 100% of the time. At least 20% where you recognize it should have been better, know why it was not, or at least ponder why not, and immediately try to improve it before going on.

Which is probably why in [ 桑原玄辰の] Kuwabara Hirotoki"s book, テンカラの技術. He sets a high standard in his casting to a can of water practice. The goal is not to just land the kebari in the water. It’s to land the kebari 80% of the time the in the can, to progressively smaller cans, PLUS not splash water outside the can, to be considered a good beginner level of casting skill. I’m not there yet.

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I agree.

The mastery of anything is a never ending process. Yet in the same time there are individuals who have mastered skills to levels far beyond the masses. In general, I think its fair to call them masters, even if they are too humble to agree.

To catch fish and be successful you do not need much at all. In fact, I caught trout on my first outing. Not just one, multiple.

Most of the concepts are fairly simple. Drag free drifts, manipulation, and recognizing fish behavior. Practice, practice, practice, and observe.

Casting into a can is very academic. Time on the water is a better practice.

“Casting into a can is very boring. Time on the water is more fun.”

Updated your last sentence to reflect my personal POV on the subject.

My point isn’t to spend time casting into a can. The point is to develop that same level of skill (consistently cast to a spot the diameter of a line spool with a soft landing) The path you take to get there is only limited by your own imagination.

Mastery would also include learning about water currents, best choice of fly, and fish behavior too where there are also many paths to gaining an understanding.

Lately I’ve been pondering about what makes a fish hit a fly or rather wondering about the answer to the ratio of motivations for hitting the fly? Hunger vs Instinctive reaction.

If you go running alone through the jungle in North India there’s a good chance a well fed Tiger will instinctively rise, chase down, catch and eat you. Predators chase things that move fast, (a fact that the theme of former safari guide Peter Allison’'s book, “Whatever You Do, Don’t Run”. Walking slow with confidence & not showing fear may save your life. Running surely will lose it).

Fish will often react the same during periods of not eating. For example during spawning they may not eat for days yet they will still often instinctively react and take a lure/fly if presented so it triggers that instinctive reaction.

This is probably the primary function for many of the sasoi presentation techniques such as: yokohiki, gyakuhiki (cross stream pull, up stream pull). vs Pause & drift or pause & feed or just normal rhythmic pulsing that probably has more to do with getting a hungry fish to notice your fly, and give it the opportunity to catch if it looks like food.

What is the ratio of reasons for a fish to take a fly when presented with various sasoi/manipulated techniques? Clearly some twitching movements only help a hungry fish see your fly. But which sasoi techniques are best for triggering an instinctive chase & eat response from a fish that is not hungry? What it the best way to develop the skills to trigger the instinctive “take” response? Is a certain type of fly better at triggering an instinctive response?

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It might be good to start a new thread on that topic.

I have my own ideas on some of it.

Somebody wants to be a tenkara master!

Not my path.

Very cool. Guess I missed seeing this while away.
That picture reminded me of this story I happened to discover a couple of months back.

https://petrolicious.com/articles/apartment-find-this-ferrari-250-gt-pf-coupe-was-hidden-in-hollywood-for-decades

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Will the car of the type is similar to tenkara

tenkara is very simple in appearance but the inside is very complex :sweat:

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Refining ones technical skill is something we all generally strive to do.

I do not think practicing is necessarily motivated to gain some status or title. Its more a dicipline linked to learning and improving. No different to how athletes practice and have drills.

I wish I had free time to practice and fish more. I have to split my tenkara time with my job, family, house, and other angling pursuits. Tenkara, sad to say is low on the priority, so when I do endulge, its mostly fishing and very little actual honing of skill.

For those with the time. Practice, practice, practice. I would.

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Yesssssss !

Practice and practice while enjoying more

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Most of my practice comes from just paying attention to what is happening while fishing, and thinking about how to do it better next cast.

certainly

Even when I can not go fishing I feel like I am in the vicinity of the mountain stream

I recall the encounter between mountain streams and fish on the lawn

Japanese mountain stream enters the prohibition fishing period

The period of making kebari begins

Although the general thesis is consistent in various specialized fields, there are differences in detail

Tenkara difference may be a new development

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My nearest stream is an hour and a half by car on a fast road. I still feel the mountain stream environment in my head. It is like a room in my home, the door is always open. I spend a lot of time in that room when I am not in the mountains.

Simplifying does not mean simple, complex processes are made efficient by design. Although the Perlan glider wing looks simple, the astronauts inside using Mountain atmospheric waves to climb to space are not simple.

But gliding is pretty simple. In America, a 14 year old can solo.

Be who you are.

Do what you want.

Tenkara is what we do.

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yes I do it

Of course it is.
This is the most important for me
But I would like to tell everything what I learned

it is 伝承(Tell the past teachings to the next generation)